This is the kind of comment I really hate seeing. It is almost always virtue signaling. People genuinely looking to help have zero problem finding my PayPal account or emailing me. The people who publicly offer assistance usually wind up really pissed off at me if I rudely try to take them up on it. It is gauche of me to take them seriously. They were just trying to look good in public for free. I am supposed to have too much shame or something to say "Yes, please." It also just puts me in an incredibly awkward position.
I find the entire thing annoying in the extreme because I have a Patreon account to help fund my blogging and I completely suck at promoting that. I also do freelance writing and resume editing and I can't get traction with that.
I sincerely appreciate it anytime anyone actually kicks a few bucks my way when I am in crisis. But I would much prefer that people take me seriously, fund my Patreon and/or hire me for paid writing so that bitching about my shit life on the internet can stop being one of my more lucrative skills.
> I find the entire thing annoying in the extreme because I have a Patreon account to help fund my blogging and I completely suck at promoting that.
> I sincerely appreciate it anytime anyone actually kicks a few bucks my way when I am in crisis. But I would much prefer that people take me seriously, fund my Patreon and/or hire me for paid writing so that bitching about my shit life on the internet can stop being one of my more lucrative skills.
I have no idea who you are. I've never heard of you. I've never seen your blog, YouTube channel, Twitch streaming account, or whatever else it is you have. I didn't read your profile or historical comments here in Hacker News to try and track you down or identify you because...
> People genuinely looking to help have zero problem finding my PayPal account or emailing me.
... I'm not going to run around the Internet looking for you.
I think I was well within my rights to offer you assistance using the most direct communication means that was available to me at the time of offering it: the comment box directly under your post. I made a safe assumption, in my opinion, that this would (and it did) reach you directly and now I'm being hosed down in public for trying to care about another human being.
I don't care about magical karma points. I'm 33 years old: I don't have the time, energy or the f--ks to give with regards to some magical Internet points that amount to sweet F/A.
I'm being sincere in my offer and it still stands. I'll email you to get further details from you about how you might want the money, if any, being sent.
Thank you for your sincerity and your email. I have already replied to your email. I apologize for you being the one who took it in the face here, but it is a kind of comment I absolutely do not want to see more of on the site for a long list of reasons.
"The road to hell is paved with good intentions." It isn't enough to mean well. Some ways of handling things simply do not work well.
The anger comes from, in personal experience, being taken out of society by things outside of your control, and whenever you ask for help being treated like a lazy beggar who has a lot of nerve even asking to survive. It comes from seeing the same "if I can help let me know" responses over and over that are really like "lets get lunch" statements and never result in actual help. Then when you get more depressed and upset that you can't get help people get defensive and dump their resentment or guilt on you more. It's a long spiral that is impossible to get out of often. Getting to the point you need help can happen to anyone...but most people need to pretend it can't and thus blame the victim and that victim's natural reactions to being crushed by life.
Man come on. I was explaining why those who suffer long term get bitter and depressed. I used to be healthy and happy and helped others for a living and personally. I was an empathetic person even then and thought I understood how people would respond, but until I lived the need I really didn't. It's not cynicism it's experience and it explains how people get grumpy and hopeless. Ask anyone who has suffered long term and they will tell you MOST people simply aren't willing to try to understand, and to truly help others. That's not a personal insult to you or those who would. When someone in pain lashes out because of their overwhelming experiences it's never about YOU but rather their fear and helplessness. The way you punched back saying "fine be a miserable person then" comes from you feeling slighted and wanting to lash out in that same way so it should be something you can empathize with.
I only want people to see the human in the suffering. The helpers are human too but are in a position of power and also have a more stable life and ability to cope. When I was working and being yelled at and unappreciated by people in severe distress I worked to never take it personally and did my very best for them. It was never about me..they had simply lost their ability to cope and needed help back to normality. It's terrifying to think about but can happen to anyone, any time.
I just wanted to answer the "why angry" question above. I have a LOT of relevant experience about this issue as both a provider and a victim. I just wanted to share that experience and explain the common behaviors. I don't want conflict and will back away and apologize if I offended you. I didn't downvote you above either in case that's added to it. I can't downvote at all anyway due to my low karma.
How about offering to help someone and then people acting like you are a bad person? How about that?
I've got nothing for or against either poster, but so many assumptions were made about someone who may have been just trying to help. Why is that fair? Why try to help anyone if you're gonna get treated like that?
I did not make assumptions about them. I talked about my experience with how this typically goes and the fact that I find this sort of comment very problematic.
It puts me in an incredibly awkward position because there is absolutely no good way for me to respond to it. If I publicly say yes and they actually help, there is a danger that this will become a running theme on the site. This would be a serious problem for me and for the moderators.
It's an inherently disrespectful way to handle the problem. The lack of real respect is one of the things that keeps certain classes of people trapped in poverty.
I have been commenting on my poverty on this site for years. I get lots of compliments on my writing here. I also get consistently told that trying to make a middle class income from my writing is a batshit insane deluded unrealistic desire.
If people genuinely respected me and genuinely cared, they could help me figure out how to turn my writing skill into a middle class income. I am not asking for charity here. I am asking to be taken seriously as someone who has a valuable skill that I would like to make a career out of. I can get no traction on finding a means to turn that into a middle class income. I have zero desire for my participation here to turn into some circus of me begging for money publicly. I see that as counter to my goal to get taken seriously and establish a career.
I also see that as a development that the mods would be fools to not ban me over. I have spent time as a moderator. That's a shitshow I would not tolerate in a community under my care.
> If people genuinely respected me and genuinely cared, they could help me figure out how to turn my writing skill into a middle class income.
Consider video. It's out pacing written material by a long shot and fast becoming how people consume knowledge. Not everyone is suited for it, but it's worth considering. The systems in place for publishing video content are also better and have a much bigger reach (without any work)
Thank you. And thank you for your Patreon pledge. The world would be a better place if there were more people like you genuinely trying to do the right thing under difficult circumstances.
You have to realize it's not about YOU and not make it an ego thing where you get offended at a suffering person's reactions. People in need are ignored, blamed and screwed with constantly and it's a normal reaction to be depressed, angry and defensive about it. But instead of having that empathy, most people react with a "Well who do you think you are? Screw you then I was trying to HELP!" and make it all about themselves. It's like people who get angry at someone in an emergency who is panicking or in pain. Yelling at them as if they are being a jerk to make the rescuer/provider's life difficult. I saw it a lot in my previous work. If you want to help others effectively you cannot make it about you and have to approach things outside your ego and gain the trust. Most people can' be bothered.
Open discussion will not necessarily reinforce anything, people have the ability to draw their own conclusions. Personally I would rather that OP stated their opinion explicitly.
Also I actually don't know what the stereotype was that was being implied.
Thank you for asking more explanations so nicely, and sorry for being so cryptic.
I think that welfare in the US is about philanthropy, charity and "good will", and not about "social rights" as in Europe.
And that comment showed exactly that attitude: the guy is kinda confused on why that woman refuses his "good will". She is asking for rights, he is offering "good will".
In my opinion, her answer created a cognitive dissonance in his mind, and that's why he answers back so angrily. I find that attitude to social welfare super American.
I think that the American approach to welfare has ethical and practical limits. Welfare based on philanthropy and good will is not an efficient welfare: it won’t change much. It also adds a moral dimension that (imho) shouldn't be there…
I really try hard not to sound cynical or jaded as that puts people off even more, but it's so difficult as I have had similar experiences with "offers of help" of all sorts. Nobody ever actually follows through. Twice in the last 2 years people have dragged my hope for work out over many months or years with no intention of ever doing anything. It always follows the same script and has made me quite hopeless.
More importantly, people like us need sustainable situations, not a wad of cash that will be gone with next month's expenses and leave us right back where we were. We need to be helped get a base under our feet to grow from as the muddy pit we live in just keeps collapsing, we also need to "learn how to fish" as the saying goes and be reintegrated into the whole. Not have scraps of fish thrown at us, no matter how well meaning the thrower is.
Yes, the public offers to help me eat when I am flat broke drive me crazy because when I talk about being unable to make adequate income as a writer, that gets dismissed as "meh, sucks to be you." People use ad blocker, tell me Patreon is charity and expect good content to be free. Then I get pity money* once in a while when things are really bad.
And it's like, hello? 2+2=4. Can you not see how these issues are related? Geez.
* My apologies to the generous souls who have compassionately given me money at times so I could eat. But the reality is I would not need such gifts if I had enough regular income, but all efforts to establish an earned income fall on deaf ears.
I find the entire thing annoying in the extreme because I have a Patreon account to help fund my blogging and I completely suck at promoting that. I also do freelance writing and resume editing and I can't get traction with that.
I sincerely appreciate it anytime anyone actually kicks a few bucks my way when I am in crisis. But I would much prefer that people take me seriously, fund my Patreon and/or hire me for paid writing so that bitching about my shit life on the internet can stop being one of my more lucrative skills.