You can add feature requests there, it should be pretty simple to extend BTT to support the remaining required features.
I have also recently been approached by shady companies trying to buy my app (I'd never do that) - maybe they are currently targeting apps that require special permissions?
I found an old Leap Motion device in a storage box with USB devices last week. The support you provided for it was great and had me waving at my desk all day.
Even though the Leap Motion is now unsupported, I still enjoy using BTT daily.
Haha, yes Leap Motion was a lot of fun and I think the BTT integration landed me my first job (@Siemens) after university. That must have been almost 10 years ago -- yep: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SDJKFtLDx4k
Wait, the software I’ve been using for what feels like decades and which always gave me a charming, cosy old school vibe due to its almost infinite options and deep understanding of OS X/macOS was written by someone younger than me!?
Mind blown.
It’s an incredible tool and among the first things I install on a new Mac.
oh that's cool. I have the original (first version) of the Leap Motion in a box somewhere. Now I want to pull it out and install BTT and see what I can do with it.
That hides icons to the left of BTT, but BTT is already my leftmost icon. Do I need to change the startup order or something? Currently using HiddenBar which works great, but if I can use fewer apps, so much the better.
And thanks for BTT! It's in my "must-have" apps for any Mac along with Karabiner Elements.
Apple really needs to just build this functionality into macOS already. You shouldn't need to pay someone else to shove icons into a drawer.
And on the new MacBooks with a notch through the center of the menu bar, it always seems like the icons on the right and the menus for the focused app on the left are ever encroaching towards that space.
Especially for people using larger sizes for accessibility, the insufficient menubar space is a silly problem that's been around for years and they've recently made much worse by adding the notch and expanding the spacing between menuextras.
It's usually OK if you're in an application that only has File, Edit, View, Window, Help, but once you get into real productivity software you're going to have menu items overflowing to the right side of the notch and your important menu extras (like VPNs) become totally inaccessible when you run out of space.
Eh. I like that this discourages usage of tray icons, which is a good thing. Your app doesn't need a tray icon, almost all apps don't. I remember back on windows xp, it felt like every darn app needed its own tray icon for some reason. To be fair, windows xp did have the ability to hide and show certain icons built-in.
> I like that this discourages usage of tray icons, which is a good thing. Your app doesn't need a tray icon, almost all apps don't
Well clearly that's not working because every app has a tray icon.
It's time to catch up with Windows XP and let users control which ones are important and which ones get hidden. And the hidden ones should still be accessible.
Bartender really nailed all that and it's sad that a 3rd party has to come in and fix this.
Almost 100% of the apps with tray icons don't really need them. They're basically marketing: If you're in charge of brand management for an app company, and there is a way to get your brand on the user's screen at all times for free, you're going to always do it, regardless of whether or not the user needs it there. Just stick some kind of context menu on the icon so you can at least justify it.
I'd love to know the actual end-user click rate for these tray icons. I bet many are near zero.
What's comical about this is that most apps ALREADY have a persistent icon on the screen - the Dock icon. From what I've seen, most mac users don't enable dock hiding, so it's always there. It's just bad design.
Ironically, a lot of the menu extras are 3rd party utilities for window management, display management, power management, hotkeys, search, etc. being used to supplement parts of the OS with limited built-in capability, but then to fix all the menu extras you have to install another one because macOS sucks at that too
These types of things tend to not have a dock icon, because they run in the background and don’t have their own windows that you common interact with or need to activate
Somewhat. I have a corporate laptop that include a bunch of system admin/security/network apps, plus others that don't show in the dock (Meeter, Magnet, etc.).
We'd be more likely to see Apple apply their infamous restrictions here, as opposed to opening things up more and lettings developers go hog wild. Bartender exists because it's a solution to a problem.
They do have it built in - but only for the default menubar items - like battery, wifi, bluetooth - etc. You can shove all of those into the control center. It works well enough for me that I don't think I need bartender anymore.
Those are the ones I want visible though. The stuff I want to hide is infrequently used things, stuff like icons for passively running background apps, stuff like the JetBrains toolbox updater, zscaler on my work machine, etc.
I’ve tried switching from Windows to MacOS three times over the past few years and each time I run up against the wall of having to research, choose and purchase small utilities to fix things that I never in a million years would’ve guessed would be an issue.
Well some of this is just getting used to MacOS though - Finder is a pretty huge adjustment (and honestly just not as good as Explorer). I agree that window management was probably the biggest sticking point for me. That being said - beyond being able to drag and snap windows side by side in Windows, I wasn't aware of any built-in management (or at least - thats all I missed when I switched a while back) that was missing in MacOS.
I’m so used to column view as a metaphor for my files and directories that I don’t understand how non-mac people deal with essentially being forced to memorise their directory structure and hierarchy.
DOpus has a collapsible tree view with a few big issues remaining (don't think it has columns, but I don't find them useful on a Mac either, also use tree view there)
Yeah, a lot of the friction comes from macOS being one of the only surviving major desktops that isn’t based on a Win9X paradigm, instead being a blend of classic Mac OS and NeXTSTEP (both dating back to the 80s) with a smattering of modern Apple. For longtime Mac users, Windows (and winlike Linux DEs) present almost as much friction.
If you hold down an alphanumeric key in MacOS, it automatically pops up an emoji selector. This is fine, except if you are someone (like me) who occasionally holds down keys to take advantage of key repeat _and_ uses vim keybindings in a few specific non-terminal applications.
There is no GUI to disable this behavior, you have to drop to a terminal, run a command, and then reboot the machine.
This is the example I now use whenever a Mac user says Linux is a pain to configure.
There are a ton of useful preferences like these that make OS X behave in ways that I find more natural. TinkerTool (https://www.bresink.com/osx/TinkerTool) has a nice “missing system preferences” GUI for configuring them. I’ve been using it for at least 15 years, but you can still download old versions for support all the way back to OS X Public Beta in the year 2000. It was one of the first things I always installed way back when defragging hard drives and occasional clean system installs were routine maintenance.
I know we’re talking about this in the context of much-loved utilities going sideways, but if tweaking system prefs is your thing it gets a strong recommend.
I really wish there was a way to disable .DS_Store on local/removable storage as well. I don’t know why but it completely bugs me having these files when I want to never customize folder views.
There used to be this brilliant utility with a brilliant name called Asepsis that let you corral the files into a specific folder (like the vim cmd directory for .swp files), so you could have the functionality without the mess, or wipe them out like (or using) a tmp dir.
Unfortunately, when SIP arrived you had to disable it to get the functionality and it died off.
One or two defaults settings would do it, c’mon Apple! There’s a reason for not shitting all over network drives, why not local storage as well?
Thanks for the helpful tips. Tangential but is there any free way to change the scroll direction of trackpad and mouse independently and to disable scroll acceleration? I have tried Mac Mouse Fix but it is not free.
Whenever you hold down a key in Linux, it always repeats, and there is no GUI to turn this into an accented character selector. Or any other means because there is no such selector to be had. Not a big knock on Linux though, because it has a working compose key instead.
Also, you don't need to reboot after toggling ApplePressAndHoldEnabled, but you do need to restart apps.
At my current job, we're issues MacBooks. My biggest pet peeve of macOS is the grouping of windows behind a single icon on the dock bar. I hate that if I have two Chrome windows open, it takes two clicks to go between them.
With the exception of modals, if a program has multiple windows open, when I should see each of them as its own item on the dock bar (or in Windows, the taskbar). I don't think even Windows makes this an option anymore, but I use WindowBlinds on my personal Win10 computer to give me that behavior while also skinning everything to look like Win2K, because I can't stand the flat aesthetic that's popular right now.
The dock is per-process because there are options to quit the program on the menu. I suppose they could switch it to close window and change to quit on the last window, but Mac users are very used to the way it is. There should be an icon there even with no windows.
I‘d imagine the dock would look quite ridiculous for someone working on multiple docs, or a slate of images in photoshop, etc.
It could just take one long click to switch between them.
Right-click the Dock icon (keep holding the button), move your mouse up to the window you want in the menu, then let go to activate that window.
I typically just keep part of each of my windows viable, so I can simply click on them, if I'm going back and forth. So it's still just one click. I got out of the habit of maximizing windows a couple decades ago when I first got a Mac and my first widescreen display.
I just really hate how there are some insane defaults that don't have easy ways to change them.
Pointer Acceleration being the biggest one. One inch of mouse movement should always be the same number of pixels of pointer movement, whether I move my mouse at a snail's pace or at mach 2. A fast, but incredibly short movement of the mouse should not produce the same pointer movement as a slow, but very wide movement.
Second was disappearing scrollbars. Those make sense on a mobile device where screen space is a premium, but on a desktop (or even a laptop!), it doesn't make sense.
Nowadays, both of those actually do have options in the System Settings panel, but when I first got introduced to using a Mac in 2014, both of those requires some archaic shell commands that I had to Google to find.
I love pointer acceleration, and won't use an OS that doesn't feature it.
I _like_ being able to perform pixel-precise movement of the cursor on a ~20MP desktop without also having to drag the mouse across the entire desk or modify mouse DPI to get from one corner to the other.
The disappearing scrollbars are awful though. I have a feeling Apple made that a default to get people to stop clicking on them out of habit.
> I _like_ being able to perform pixel-precise movement of the cursor on a ~20MP desktop without also having to drag the mouse across the entire desk or modify mouse DPI to get from one corner to the other.
shrug
I can do pixel-precise movement without acceleration, I just have to move the mouse a lot slower.
The problem is that in my experience, people conflate DPI with sensitivity, and so say things like "1000 DPI is sensitive enough for me". But of course, with only 1000 DPI, without acceleration, and with moderate sensitivity, you kind of get aliasing in pointer movements. You'll move the mouse as slow as you can, but the pointer will jump in 2-4 pixel increments.
I have a 16,000 DPI gaming mouse and set the DPI in the driver to that maximum, then lower sensitivity to compensate. The result is that I can get pixel-perfect movement if I want to, though I admit that it requires a much steadier hand than if I were to just enable acceleration.
I probably should've clarified that I absolutely understand the hate for pointer acceleration. I just disagree that it's bad UX ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Your point though does make we wish that DPI, sensitivity, and the acceleration curve were all configurable directly in the pointer settings for Mac and Windows.
They won't be able to make as powerful of an app as illustrated by plenty of other advanced customization apps touching on almost every "core" OS features that they've already built in
So instead they should make it easier to achieve this icon management without too invasive permissions
What looks odd to me is this silence about acquisition. I've got a lot of emails and read enough blog posts from developers that brags about new owners and new opportunities that goes with it.
Bartender is just utility app, but has permissions to e.g screen recording, so new version from new developer without prior explanation just seems shady
Reminds me of the silent takeover of the Stylish browser extension that was sold to some analytics company and then reported your complete browsing history to said company. No information to the users until someone noticed what what going on.
Similar things seemed to have happened to the ModHeader extension, newer versions now inject ads.
The Mac app scene especially is pretty small and tight-knit. Lots of indie developers have been around for decades and know each other well. That makes it even more jarring for an app to get acquired by a totally unknown company.
I'm surprised people keep trying to touch macOS apps like this. macOS productivity app users are some of the most keen and aware users on the market.
Trying to pull a move like this and trying to hide it away like a quiet fart? We can smell enshittification from a mile away and we already know it smells like shit in here.
With the most recent update, macOS notified me that I needed to allow new permissions. But macOS didn't explain that this was because the cert changed. When I Googled the issue, I found this support article: https://www.macbartender.com/Bartender5/PermissionIssues/
The support article doesn't mention the cert change or the new owners, and instead calls it "a known issue where certain apps, including Bartender, might not receive Accessibility and Screen Recording permissions properly, despite the user granting them in System Settings."
I couldn't get the screen recording permission to work at all after the last update. I emailed the dev(s?) and had a short exchange where they tried to help but it never got resolved.
I’ve been using this for the last six hours or so, and it’s decent. You use Cmd+drag to move icons between shown and unshown, which at the time of writing isn’t clear from the Readme or site
yeah, no reason these days to use proprietary solutions for small problems. I'll check out Ice, it seems much more modern (and maintained) than Dozer: https://github.com/Mortennn/Dozer
I just wish somebody would create an open source alternative to Rouge Amoeba's Loopback!
> I just wish somebody would create an open source alternative to Rouge [sic] Amoeba's Loopback!
Rogue Amoeba has been around for over two decades. They are an early macOS X shop and their softwares are best of breed. Their esteemed Audio Hijack recently received an overhaul to its permissions structure. My understanding (gleaned from a podcast?) is Rogue Amoeba worked closely with Apple on this reworking.
It is doubtful Rogue Amoeba would ever silently sell to an unknown developer.
Rogue Amoeba is precisely the kind of software shop worth supporting with your money and time. I say this only as a satisfied user of several of their products.
I have nothing against OSS and do use many OSS products; I also support software shops that produce good software at a good price and have demonstrated loyalty and commitment to their users. Rogue Amoeba is just such a shop.
I got a new Mac recently, had run Bartender in the past and decided to but the newest version without checking it out first. I was surprised to see the screen recording permission.
This was 12 days ago. I wrote support saying:
> I think screen recording is too much of a privacy and security concern.
> Even if you have no bad intentions, if someone compromises your security, they have access to an app that I've allowed screen recording to.
They replied:
> Bartender 5 isn't actually capturing your screen, this message will show anytime Bartender gets an image of your menu bar items, Bartender only ever gets images of menu bar items, the menu bar, and the desktop wallpaper behind the menu bar.
> That said, we are thinking of a way to isolate the parts of the app that need this particular permission so that way it becomes optional.
Yes, but you had to re-enable it due to the cert change. Bartender doesn't explain this is what happened and simply states "there's a known issue where certain apps, including Bartender, might not receive Accessibility and Screen Recording permissions properly, despite the user granting them in System Settings."
I agree the communication about this change of ownership has been far from ideal.
But issues with permissions (e.g. the user needing to disable/re-enable some macOS permission after an update, even if the cert doesn't change) are fairly common.
I assume if there was a way to recreate what Bartender does as smoothly as Bartender without the recording permission, they or someone else would have done it by now considering it makes the setup process clunkier than what would be ideal.
This ain't Linux, it's honestly surprising Bartender and various window management apps and whatnot can be pulled off on macOS considering the restrictions. It's not surprising they need to do a weird hack like taking advantage of screen recording privileges to make it work.
Our docks require the same permission as a way to verify the multiple monitors are actually working. As a result I just bring my usb-c dongle and a couple usb-c -> displayport cables instead
> Future plans for the app remain unknown, but users have a right to know what’s going on behind the scenes.
Do they though? You buy a license for a piece of software, and as far as I understand that doesn't include any fundamental rights involving insight into company policies, direction, business strategy, ...
Regardless, this is of course quite a dubious takeover.
The thing is that you bought a license for Bartender 5 and up until version 5.0.49 it was shipped by one owner, then from 5.0.52 onwards by a different owner.
Users absolutely have a right to know that the same software they bought is now being packaged by someone else. We're not talking about a different license or version 6 or whatever. Same software, different owner over night.
Also, this doesn't seem to be true anymore, the new owners did outline some future plans:
> [...] We've collaborated closely with Ben to understand his vision for Bartender. Our goal is to implement many of the improvements he had planned and address any reported bugs from the past few months to enhance Bartender's performance. [...]
This is often a major sticking point in M&A when you find out major contracts are not assignable or transferable depending on terms in those contracts. This can be with customers or vendors. My guess is a consumer app like Bartender isn’t going to have this issue, but just figured I’d share for a lucky 10k scenario.
I've been using Dozer for some time with no complaints, I'm not sure how much of the feature set overlaps as I use it primarily hiding extraneous menubar items.
One of the great features of Bartender is that it can unhide icons when they change or match a particular state. Handy for, e.g., hiding the battery until you're down to 30% or hiding your VPN icon whilst you're not connected.
(let's hope some other apps pick up these features if Bartender turns out to have gone down a dark path)
This happens with OSS apps as well, see the Simple Mobile Tools takeover by an Israeli adware company, affecting several popular Android apps (Gallery, File Manager, others).
The difference is that you can fork if there's a breakdown in the developer user relationship. This is much better than being held hostage if you rely on the software.
I put together a small commandline tool to help catch these developer cert-swap situations. I wrapped it up in a LaunchAgent to periodically check and alert to this condition.
Evernote worked reliably and well for me across Windows, Linux, and macOS when I was at school in the early 2010s. It had a great web clipper and it was good at handling PDFs and images. Apple Notes could not replicate that. While I pay for Obsidian nowadays, I find it nowhere near as usable as my Evernote setup at that time.
I gave up on Evernote around 2009 when they lost notes, corrupted them, and formatting was highly-inconsistent. Neither the Blackberry nor the iOS apps were entirely usable at that time. Maybe it improved after that, but it was just too slow, limited, risky, and untrustworthy.
It's certainly possible that I got lucky to avoid the numerous data loss incidents and my use cases went along the happy path. I gave it up around 2013 due to privacy concerns.
Bartender is the absolute best at what it did. I tried Jordan Baird's ICE but too much stuff was missing and I don't have as much time to hack as I did in years past. Shame that the dev sold out without warning.
Assuming that Homebrew doesn't get poisoned with a haxored version of Bartender, you can install a non-tainted version of Bartender from Homebrew by installing it from its formula URL.
Homebrew does not make it easy to do this, but it is possible:
This is good reason for why applications should be containerized. The Old OS X way of simply putting a bundle into the Applications directory was a good start.
The applause.dev home page makes bold claims about "transparency" yet the names behind the company are hidden and nowhere to be found. Why would a company want to keep the names of their CEO, founders and owners hidden?
On an (kind of) unrelated note: If your mouse cursor suddenly stops changing shape when hovering over links for example, restart Bartender. It’s a known bug that they apparently don’t care enough about to fix.
Yes, but it was sold to an acquirer by the original author.
Making it open source would have interfered with the author’s profit goal. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to make profit from your work and protect the source.
Likewise, you’re free to avoid software that isn’t open source. However, it’s useless to make these demands that someone should have open sourced their work when that clearly wasn’t in the best interests of their goals.
I know at least of Textual. Open source but you can buy a pre-built binary for $10. Compiling it yourself was fairly easy when I tried it out once though.
I think the point was that open-sourced apps aren't vulnerable to an attack vector like this, which is true. Of course, not everything can be open-sourced, but the poster's point still stands.
Except that it's not really true, since open-sourced applications can and most definitely have changed maintainers. And even if they don't, there's still a risk. Do I need to remind everyone of the xz incident when it's so recent?
I refrained to install Bartender on a new machine (despite having a license) because of the scary permissions it want me to grant it. I found an open source alternative that fits my needs. Check if fits yours.
For a piece of software that has screen recording access on my device, I'd rather we have someone to hold accountable and is willing to put their reputation on the line to disincentivize them from updating it one day to start sending off images to home.
TBH, commercial software publishers with over $20M USD revenue or more than 25 employees should list a physical office and mailing address, and publish the membership of their leadership team. Hiding behind anonymity and randomly-generated nonsense brand names doesn't solve trust issues, but putting brands->reputations->names does heal it.
The fact that it was sold, but the selling was not announced, is incredibly shady. Normally, a developer shouts it from the rooftops, so it makes me raise an eyebrow and wonder if a condition of the sale was to not announce the sale.
Maybe I'm being pessimistic, but I think you're being naive.
You can add feature requests there, it should be pretty simple to extend BTT to support the remaining required features.
I have also recently been approached by shady companies trying to buy my app (I'd never do that) - maybe they are currently targeting apps that require special permissions?